Culture Genocide?

foxhunt99

It seems that some western people got brain washed that the Chinese government is committing a genocide on Tibetan Culture.  But lets take a look at Indian Boarding School in the US first, see who commit the real genocide.

NPR reports full article and audio here:
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=16516865

"For the government, it was a possible solution to the so-called Indian problem. For the tens of thousands of Indians who went to boarding schools, it's largely remembered as a time of abuse and desecration of culture."

The late performer and Indian activist Floyd Red Crow Westerman was haunted by his memories of boarding school. As a child, he left his reservation in South Dakota for the Wahpeton Indian Boarding School in North Dakota. Sixty years later, he still remembers watching his mother through the window as he left.

He sang about his experiences growing up: "You put me in your boarding school, made me learn your white man rule, be a fool."

The federal government began sending American Indians to off-reservation boarding schools in the 1870s, when the United States was still at war with Indians.

An Army officer, Richard Pratt, founded the first of these schools. He based it on an education program he had developed in an Indian prison. He described his philosophy in a speech he gave in 1892.

"A great general has said that the only good Indian is a dead one," Pratt said. "In a sense, I agree with the sentiment, but only in this: that all the Indian there is in the race should be dead. Kill the Indian in him, and save the man."

In 1945, Bill Wright, a Pattwin Indian, was sent to the Stewart Indian School in Nevada. He was just 6 years old. Wright remembers matrons bathing him in kerosene and shaving his head. Students at federal boarding schools were forbidden to express their culture — everything from wearing long hair to speaking even a single Indian word. Wright said he lost not only his language, but also his American Indian name.

According to Tsianina Lomawaima, head of the American Indian Studies program at the University of Arizona, the intent was to completely transform people, inside and out.

"Language, religion, family structure, economics, the way you make a living, the way you express emotion, ever"

[ Last edited by foxhunt99 at 4-6-2008 02:41 ]

shaomaike

Thanks for that.

It's outrageous because there's people from the US, Canada, and Australia coming to the forum crying about human rights and genocide in Tibet / China, when they're living on the graveyards of aboriginal people whose lands were stolen through mass murder, violent displacement and cultural genocide.

They are strangely silent about the cultural genocide on which their own countries are founded, or how the aboriginal inhabitants are doing today.  They avoid the obvious problem in their own backyard, yet go on a crusade against a foreign country and people they don't even really know about.

It seems to be a part of Western nations' mentality to project their own problems onto other nations.

[ Last edited by shaomaike at 4-6-2008 09:55 ]

deathlibrarian

Australians are ashamed of the awful things that were done to the aboriginals. Our Prime Minister recently made a public apology, and the Australian government tries to help where it can. Some of these atrocities were done 100 - 150 years ago.... but I would hope that Australia has learnt from it all.
However since federation, Australia has not gone around invading other countries. In fact, we actually gave a possession we looked after back to its people, and it is now a separate nation - Papua New Guinea.

When is China going to say sorry? When is China going to give back Tibet to its people?

And why do the atrocities committed against the Indians or the Aboriginals 150 years ago make it ok for China to commit human rights abuses?

foxhunt99

Original posted by deathlibrarian at 4-6-2008 11:19
When is China going to say sorry? When is China going to give back Tibet to its people?

China said sorry to alot things.  The Great Leap Forward in 1950s, the culture revolution in the 1960-1970s, all Chinese suffered from those.  During those time, not only Tibetan, the whole China suffered human rights issues.  It seems that there is the perception that the human rights issue only exist in Tibet.  Also, why should China give back Tibet, Tibet has been part China like 1000 years ago, it all depend on how you interpret history.  Should England give back Northern Ireland by the same standard? And Americans give back the land to Indians?

And why do the atrocities committed against the Indians or the Aboriginals 150 years ago make it ok for China to commit human rights abuses?

First, it didn't only happen 150 years ago, it is still happening now in many different forms here in the rest of the world.  Women was not allowed to vote in US until 1920.  US armies in Iraq committed many atrocities, tortures etc. You think there is no discrimination against minority in the US now?

However you are right, it doesn't make it ok for China to commit human rights abuse.  But what abuse did Chinese government do specially to the Tibetan people?  Do you know? Or you just simply heard some one side stories from Tibetan independentists?  As far as I can tell, China's minority policy give Tibetan some big advantages over regular Han Chinese.

I lived 17 years in China and 12 in US, I fully aware of the human rights problems in both countries, it is seems the western world is more hypocritic, and like to make some accusation based on one side stories.

[ Last edited by foxhunt99 at 4-6-2008 22:54 ]

deathlibrarian

Dude, as I said just because there are human rights problems in Iraq doesn't mean that its ok to have human rights problems in China.
All people should be free of occupation, Iraq and China.

When the US pulls out of Iraq, will china pull out of Tibet? The Iraqi's get to vote for their government, will the Tibetans get to vote?

As for the attacks against the Aboriginals, (and the American Indians) the worst ones were in the 1800's.

Northern Ireland gets to vote every year at elections. They could vote and back a party that wanted independence if they wanted to, but they vote to stay part of the UK. And the Uk let the largest part of Ireland get its independance about 80 years ago.
When is Tibet going to Vote?

And Tibet has not been part of China for 1000 years. It was independant up till 1650, and then was independant in 1911 up until the occupation started.

foxhunt99

Where did you hear that Tibetans want independence?  From Dalai Lama?

Why don't you go to Tibet yourself, see if the Tibetans really want independence.

deathlibrarian

Where did you hear that they don't want independence? From Chinese state run Television?
The Dalai Lama only wants autonomy for his people, not independence.

Why do you think they rioted and destroyed 1000 chinese run shops in Lhasa? because they are happy?

Why don't you go there and talk to the Tibetans and ask them if they are happy with the way they are treated?

foxhunt99

My wife just happened to lived with Tibetans for 4 years.  The number of Tibetan people who want independence are really minority.  What do you think people generally want? Food, peaceful life, entertainment, etc, so far their life was way better comparing to the Dalai Lama period.  

You need to go see yourself before trusting any propaganda by the western media.

Anthrophobia

"A great general has said that the only good Indian is a dead one," Pratt said. "In a sense, I agree with the sentiment, but only in this: that all the Indian there is in the race should be dead. Kill the Indian in him, and save the man."

It's interesting to note that Pratt was actually one of the more liberal sides of Indian "reform". Many during his time thought Indians were "savages" incapable of being "civilized". Back then there were those who advocated that Indian culture was inferior, along with Indian people. Pratt thinks that Indian culture may be inferior, but Indian people can be taught to be on par with the white man. By now we can see just how far the world had went when it comes to accepting differing cultures, though not far enough(it seems to me the minute we recognize another culture as equal we have to go nitpicking against other cultures, human instinct I suppose). I suggest the author Zitkala-Sa for those who are interested. She is one of those who is a first-hand source for these educational establishments imposed on the Indians.

Kim2

"When the US pulls out of Iraq, will china pull out of Tibet? The Iraqi's get to vote for their government, will the Tibetans get to vote?"

Let me remind you that YOUR dear democratic government accepts one China and accepts that Tibet is part of China!  Everyone accepts that Iraq is an independent nation!  You are certainly confusing yourself.  China will never pull out of Tibet as some people in the west wish, even not when France pulls out of Paris, Brtitain pulls out of London, or US pulls out of Texas!  Why one has to pull out  a bedroom from his own house?  Your comment does not have any logic.  As for the so-called "free election" in Iraq, it's a joke.  It   had to be approved by its master before it could call itself a "government".   Suggest you to read modern world history to see how many democratically elected governments have been overthrown by main west poweres (with various means)  simply because they did not fit special interests  of those powers.

[ Last edited by Kim2 at 9-6-2008 13:59 ]