That's a great question. The answer is it is out there! For one Qiangba Puncog and his entire administration of tibet have came out and said so, but you might say that's not trusted and rightfully so. If you go to youtube and search for "Tibet Diary" a supposed PBS documentary of 2 San Franciscan's in Tibet.. if you don't want to watch the whole thing just skip to segment 4 or 6. Also i have a book recommendation for you, "Struggle for a Modern Tibet" written by Tashi Tsering, a former Tibetan Exile that went back to build schools in Tibet, he's certainly not a communist sympathizers as he was jailed for years during the cultural revolution, but he tells an interesting story. The mistake most westerners make is they assume the voice of Exile Tibetans represent the voice of all Tibetans since that's the one they hear most. Truth is when the exiles left the 95% of tibetans left were vitually all illiterate, it takes much time to build school so they will have a voice, most of them today still can't speak fluent Chinese let alone english, which is why we don't hear their voices much today. Thanks for the question.

China never forced Tibetian to learn mandarin as the first language. Tibet lanuage is their first language in the school the same as that Wei wu er ethnic boy.  Most of tibetan today still can't speak fluent Chinese let alone english, which is why you don't hear their voices much today! In the other way, with pre-judgement in your mind, it is obvious you just hear what you want to hear! There's plenty of other voice you have not heard from general tibetians.

An article I read online----



Anti-China protests made in USA, not Tibet
By Gary Wilson
Published Apr 20, 2008 11:39 PM

Most noteworthy about the protests in London, Paris and San Francisco that targeted the Olympic Torch on its way to the Beijing Olympics was their character.

Take the events in San Francisco on April 9. The biggest numbers to turn out were not protesters. They were from the Chinese community—thousands according to an NPR report—and came to show their support for China. There may have been nearly as many police—more than 3,000 according to city officials.

The anti-China protests were small in numbers. The Guardian (British) reported about 300 in San Francisco; other wire reports said simply hundreds.

The small numbers might be a surprise if you’d followed the big news coverage leading up to the event. No protest in recent memory has received such major media coverage in the week or two before it happened. Such media coverage gives the impression that a big event is to take place.

The small numbers of anti-China protesters might be attributed to the fact that the protesters claimed to be representing the interests of the people of Tibet, but they were not themselves Tibetan. There were at most a handful of Tibetans.

Actually, there are few Tibetans outside Tibet. The exile community is small—estimates put it at 100,000 to 200,000 at most—and almost all are in Nepal or India. So it is not Tibetans who are in London, Paris or San Francisco, but non-Tibetans—mainly North Americans or Western Europeans—who are protesting against China, claiming that they speak for the Tibetans.
When size doesn’t matter

Maybe it wasn’t the size of the event that mattered to the big-business-controlled media in the U.S., but rather the message.

FAIR (Fairness and Accuracy In Reporting) has documented the censorship that dominates the U.S. media. It is a censorship imposed not by the government but by the owners of the media. The political message of an event determines whether it is covered in the news media or censored out.

Most glaring has been the lack of coverage of anti-war protests in all the U.S. media, from newspapers to television and radio.

Several FAIR reports showed the systematic way that the media have ignored or distorted all protests against the Iraq war, for example. Demonstrations that drew hundreds of thousands not only got no attention in the days or weeks leading up to them, but sometimes were never covered at all or were only barely mentioned.

The April 2003 FAIR magazine reported: “In its news coverage in the period before the invasion [of Iraq] began on March 19, the New York Times played down opposition to war and exaggerated support for George W. Bush’s Iraq policy—in ways that ranged from questionable to dishonest. ...

“After the invasion began, when more than 100,000 people in New York City demonstrated on March 22, it was front-page news the next day in the Washington Post and the Boston Globe. But the New York Times, whose offices are two blocks away from where the anti-war march started, placed the story on page B11,” FAIR concluded.

The contrast with the coverage of the anti-China protests today shows the political agenda being pursued by the U.S. media. It has nothing to do with the size of the protests.
Washington’s hidden role

The anti-China protests were planned in Washington, London and Paris, not in Tibet or the Tibetan exile communities.

In fact, Washington’s heavy role in the protests, using Tibet and Tibetans as a cover for an anti-China agenda, has spurred public criticism from no less than the former leader of the Free Tibet Campaign.

Patrick French, once the director of that group in London, wrote an opinion piece that the New York Times published on March 22. He said the exile community led by the Dalai Lama in India is making outlandish demands and claims.

For example, part of what he calls the Dalai Lama’s “Hollywood strategy” is to lay claim to a so-called Greater Tibet, demanding territory never considered part of Tibet.

Another example French gives is the claim made by the “Free Tibet” groups in London and Washington that 1.2 million Tibetans have been killed by the Chinese since the Dalai Lama regime was overturned in 1959. His own exhaustive research, he says, has turned up no evidence to back this claim.

Such distortions and misinformation are put forward not by Tibetans in Tibet, French says. They are put forward by those with a hidden agenda who are behind the “Free Tibet” campaign.

“The International Campaign for Tibet, based in Washington, is now a more powerful and effective force on global opinion than the Dalai Lama’s outfit in northern India. The European and American pro-Tibet organizations are the tail that wags the dog of the Tibetan government-in-exile,” French wrote.

How can you comment the data below? Please, only arguments, no slogans.
Thanks.

Compare the feudal past and the socialist present

Over 1.2 million Tibetans have died as a direct result of the Chinese invasion and occupation of Tibet. Today, it is hard to come across a Tibetan family that has not had at least one member imprisoned or killed by the Chinese regime.
Let us examine the facts.


1949-1979: Killings and destructions

According to one Chinese source, the PLA "exterminated" more than 5,700 Tibetan "soldiers", and imprisoned more than 2,000 in different areas of eastern Tibet between 7 and 25 October, 1950. [A Survey of Tibet Autonomous Region, Tibet People's Publishing House, 1984]

Accounts of massacres, tortures and killings, bombardment of monasteries, extermination of whole nomad camps are well documented. Quite a number of these reports have been also documented by the International Commission of Jurists' 1960 report on Tibet.

According to a secret Chinese military document, the PLA crushed 996 rebellions in Kanlho, Amdo, over the period 1952-58, killing over 10,000 Tibetans. [Work Report of the 11th PLA Division, 1952-1958] Similarly, the population of another Amdo area of Golok had its population reduced from about 130,000 in 1956 to about 60,000 in 1963.[China Spring, June 1986] Speaking about the same area, the Panchen Lama said:


If there was a film made on all the atrocities perpetrated in Qinghai Province, it would shock the viewers. In Golok area, many people were killed and their dead bodies rolled down the hill into a big ditch. The soldiers told the family members and relatives of the dead people that they should celebrate since the rebels have been wiped out. They were even forced to dance on the dead bodies. Soon after, they were also massacred with machine guns. [Speech by the Panchen Lama at a meeting of the Sub-Committee of the National People's Congress in Peking on situation in Tibet, 28 March 1987]

In a crackdown operation launched in the wake of the National Uprising of 10 March 1959 in Lhasa, 10,000 to 15,000 Tibetans were killed within three days. According to a secret 1960 PLA Tibet Military District Political Department report, between March 1959 and October 1960, 87,000 Tibetans were killed in Central Tibet alone. [Xizang Xingshi he Renwu Jiaoyu de Jiben Jiaocai, 1960] According to information compiled by the Tibetan Administration in exile, over 1.2 million Tibetans died between 1949 and 1979.
In a crackdown operation launched in the wake of the National Uprising of 10 March 1959 in Lhasa, 10,000 to 15,000 Tibetans were killed within three days. According to a secret 1960 PLA Tibet Military District Political Department report, between March 1959 and October 1960, 87,000 Tibetans were killed in Central Tibet alone. [Xizang Xingshi he Renwu Jiaoyu de Jiben Jiaocai, 1960] According to information compiled by the Tibetan Administration in exile, over 1.2 million Tibetans died between 1949 and 1979.

MODE OF DEATH            U-TSANG        KHAM             AMDO          TOTAL

Tortured in prison        93,560              64,877             14,784          173,221

Executed                28,267              32,266             96,225         156,758

Killed in Fighting        143,253             240,410             49,042          432,705

Starved to death        131,072             89,916            121,982          342,970

Suicide                          3,375              3,952              1,675            9,002

"Struggled" to death         27,951             48,840             15,940           92,731

Total:-                    427,478   480,261            299,648    1,207,387

Deaths in prisons and labour and concentration camps
Compilation of figures based on testimonies of survivors of prisons and labour camps show that throughout Tibet about 70 per cent of the inmates died. For example, in the wilderness of the northern Tibetan plains at Jhang Tsalakha more than 10,000 prisoners were kept in five prisons and forced to mine and transport borax. According to some of the survivors of these camps, every day 10 to 30 died from hunger, beating and overwork; in a year more than 8,000 had died. Likewise, in the construction of Lhasa Ngachen Hydro-electric Power Station, now falsely claimed to have been built by the PLA, everyday at least three or four dead prisoners were seen being thrown into the nearby river or burnt. To cite an example from eastern Tibet, from 1960 to 1962, 12,019 inmates died at a lead mine in Dartsedo district, according to a former inmate, Mrs. Adhi Tap* from Nyarong, Kham.


Human rights in Tibet today

The death of Mao Zedong in September 1976 resulted in a change in Chinese policies. The signal tune of that change was economic liberalisation and openness, and even some degree of leniency on political prisoners.

But liberalisation and openness, as it turned out, did not signal a change of attitude towards political freedom in Tibet.

Peaceful demonstrations are suppressed by police and paramilitary leading to riots. Despite all measures of repression, demonstrations continued throughout Tibet after 1987.

Arbitrary arrests, incommunicado detentions, disappearances and summary executions

Evidences of arbitrary arrests and incommunicado detention often resulting in disappearances, and summary executions, are cited in the 1990 report of AI which pointed out that "over 1,000 people, including prisoners of conscience, were arrested after martial law was imposed in Lhasa in March" and that "some of them were summarily executed." It also pointed out that "evidences of persistent human rights violations in Tibet continued to come to light in 1989, including reports of numerous arbitrary arrests, long-term detention without charge or trial, and torture".

Under Chinese rule in Tibet, there is no question of informing prisoners of the grounds for their arrest and their right to legal remedies. Arrest warrants are rarely issued or produced.

Incommunicado detention is almost routine. Often it is left to the device of the relatives of the arrested person to locate him or her. [Defying the Dragon: China and Human Rights in Tibet, LAWASIA and TIN, London, March 1991, p. 33]

A person taken into custody is declared arrested only after a period ranging from several days to months, or even years. During the period of the initial detention there is no question of informing the family since he is "legally" not arrested.


Torture

In Tibet, torture is the only known and expected method of interrogating prisoners. China's signing of the Convention Against Torture on 12 December 1986, and its supposed coming into force at the end of 1988, did not alter the trend.

Methods and instruments of torture and ill-treatment have been described by a number of former prisoners who had been subjected to them. These include indiscriminate beating with anything available on hand such as electric batons, kicking, punching, hitting with rifle-butt, stick, and even iron bar. In prison, cruel and degrading methods of torture for the purpose of extracting confessions have been reported. These include setting of guard dogs on prisoners, use of electric batons especially on women prisoners in extremely perverted and degrading manners, inflicting cigarette burns, administration of electric shock, etc. One recent refugee from eastern Tibet, who was a member of the Chinese Public Security Bureau, described thirty-three methods of torture of prisoners. New methods of torture are being constantly devised and this has been acknowledged in at least one internal party document in Tibet. ["To Control Others, First Control Yourself", H'o Phan in TAR Internal Party Study Document, in Tibetan, issue No. 2, September 1989, p. 21 ff.]

Myth of Tibetan self-rule

In its White Paper, China claims that under the "democratic reform in 1959" it "introduced the new political system of people's democracy"; and that the Tibetan people "have become masters of the country". N

How can you comment the data below? Please, only arguments, no slogans.
Thanks.

Compare the feudal past and the socialist present

Over 1.2 million Tibetans have died as a direct result of the Chinese invasion and occupation of Tibet. Today, it is hard to come across a Tibetan family that has not had at least one member imprisoned or killed by the Chinese regime.
Let us examine the facts.


1949-1979: Killings and destructions

According to one Chinese source, the PLA "exterminated" more than 5,700 Tibetan "soldiers", and imprisoned more than 2,000 in different areas of eastern Tibet between 7 and 25 October, 1950. [A Survey of Tibet Autonomous Region, Tibet People's Publishing House, 1984]

Accounts of massacres, tortures and killings, bombardment of monasteries, extermination of whole nomad camps are well documented. Quite a number of these reports have been also documented by the International Commission of Jurists' 1960 report on Tibet.

According to a secret Chinese military document, the PLA crushed 996 rebellions in Kanlho, Amdo, over the period 1952-58, killing over 10,000 Tibetans. [Work Report of the 11th PLA Division, 1952-1958] Similarly, the population of another Amdo area of Golok had its population reduced from about 130,000 in 1956 to about 60,000 in 1963.[China Spring, June 1986] Speaking about the same area, the Panchen Lama said:


If there was a film made on all the atrocities perpetrated in Qinghai Province, it would shock the viewers. In Golok area, many people were killed and their dead bodies rolled down the hill into a big ditch. The soldiers told the family members and relatives of the dead people that they should celebrate since the rebels have been wiped out. They were even forced to dance on the dead bodies. Soon after, they were also massacred with machine guns. [Speech by the Panchen Lama at a meeting of the Sub-Committee of the National People's Congress in Peking on situation in Tibet, 28 March 1987]

In a crackdown operation launched in the wake of the National Uprising of 10 March 1959 in Lhasa, 10,000 to 15,000 Tibetans were killed within three days. According to a secret 1960 PLA Tibet Military District Political Department report, between March 1959 and October 1960, 87,000 Tibetans were killed in Central Tibet alone. [Xizang Xingshi he Renwu Jiaoyu de Jiben Jiaocai, 1960] According to information compiled by the Tibetan Administration in exile, over 1.2 million Tibetans died between 1949 and 1979.
In a crackdown operation launched in the wake of the National Uprising of 10 March 1959 in Lhasa, 10,000 to 15,000 Tibetans were killed within three days. According to a secret 1960 PLA Tibet Military District Political Department report, between March 1959 and October 1960, 87,000 Tibetans were killed in Central Tibet alone. [Xizang Xingshi he Renwu Jiaoyu de Jiben Jiaocai, 1960] According to information compiled by the Tibetan Administration in exile, over 1.2 million Tibetans died between 1949 and 1979.

MODE OF DEATH            U-TSANG        KHAM             AMDO          TOTAL

Tortured in prison        93,560              64,877             14,784          173,221

Executed                28,267              32,266             96,225         156,758

Killed in Fighting        143,253             240,410             49,042          432,705

Starved to death        131,072             89,916            121,982          342,970

Suicide                          3,375              3,952              1,675            9,002

"Struggled" to death         27,951             48,840             15,940           92,731

Total:-                    427,478   480,261            299,648    1,207,387

Deaths in prisons and labour and concentration camps
Compilation of figures based on testimonies of survivors of prisons and labour camps show that throughout Tibet about 70 per cent of the inmates died. For example, in the wilderness of the northern Tibetan plains at Jhang Tsalakha more than 10,000 prisoners were kept in five prisons and forced to mine and transport borax. According to some of the survivors of these camps, every day 10 to 30 died from hunger, beating and overwork; in a year more than 8,000 had died. Likewise, in the construction of Lhasa Ngachen Hydro-electric Power Station, now falsely claimed to have been built by the PLA, everyday at least three or four dead prisoners were seen being thrown into the nearby river or burnt. To cite an example from eastern Tibet, from 1960 to 1962, 12,019 inmates died at a lead mine in Dartsedo district, according to a former inmate, Mrs. Adhi Tap* from Nyarong, Kham.


Human rights in Tibet today

The death of Mao Zedong in September 1976 resulted in a change in Chinese policies. The signal tune of that change was economic liberalisation and openness, and even some degree of leniency on political prisoners.

But liberalisation and openness, as it turned out, did not signal a change of attitude towards political freedom in Tibet.

Peaceful demonstrations are suppressed by police and paramilitary leading to riots. Despite all measures of repression, demonstrations continued throughout Tibet after 1987.

Arbitrary arrests, incommunicado detentions, disappearances and summary executions

Evidences of arbitrary arrests and incommunicado detention often resulting in disappearances, and summary executions, are cited in the 1990 report of AI which pointed out that "over 1,000 people, including prisoners of conscience, were arrested after martial law was imposed in Lhasa in March" and that "some of them were summarily executed." It also pointed out that "evidences of persistent human rights violations in Tibet continued to come to light in 1989, including reports of numerous arbitrary arrests, long-term detention without charge or trial, and torture".

Under Chinese rule in Tibet, there is no question of informing prisoners of the grounds for their arrest and their right to legal remedies. Arrest warrants are rarely issued or produced.

Incommunicado detention is almost routine. Often it is left to the device of the relatives of the arrested person to locate him or her. [Defying the Dragon: China and Human Rights in Tibet, LAWASIA and TIN, London, March 1991, p. 33]

A person taken into custody is declared arrested only after a period ranging from several days to months, or even years. During the period of the initial detention there is no question of informing the family since he is "legally" not arrested.


Torture

In Tibet, torture is the only known and expected method of interrogating prisoners. China's signing of the Convention Against Torture on 12 December 1986, and its supposed coming into force at the end of 1988, did not alter the trend.

Methods and instruments of torture and ill-treatment have been described by a number of former prisoners who had been subjected to them. These include indiscriminate beating with anything available on hand such as electric batons, kicking, punching, hitting with rifle-butt, stick, and even iron bar. In prison, cruel and degrading methods of torture for the purpose of extracting confessions have been reported. These include setting of guard dogs on prisoners, use of electric batons especially on women prisoners in extremely perverted and degrading manners, inflicting cigarette burns, administration of electric shock, etc. One recent refugee from eastern Tibet, who was a member of the Chinese Public Security Bureau, described thirty-three methods of torture of prisoners. New methods of torture are being constantly devised and this has been acknowledged in at least one internal party document in Tibet. ["To Control Others, First Control Yourself", H'o Phan in TAR Internal Party Study Document, in Tibetan, issue No. 2, September 1989, p. 21 ff.]

Myth of Tibetan self-rule

In its White Paper, China claims that under the "democratic reform in 1959" it "introduced the new political system of people's democracy"; and that the Tibetan people "have become masters of the country". Nothing could be further from the truth. Though the "TAR" is claimed to be "autonomous", Tibetans have little or no say in running their own affairs. Final decision-making power has always been held by the Chinese Communist Party through its "TAR Regional" Party's First Secretary who has always been a Chinese: In 1959, it was Zhang Guhua; he was followed successively by Tseng Yun Ya, Ren Rong, Yin Fatang, Wu Jinhua, Hu Jintao and Chen Kuiyuan.

At all so-called democratic meetings, pre-determined proposals of the concerned Chinese Communist Party body are tabled only to be praised and approved by show of hands. Making criticisms, amendments or alternative suggestions are impermissible profanities. The pre-determined outcome of such a meeting is then declared to be "democratic decision of the people".

Whatever may be the position a Tibetan occupies in the Chinese hierarchy in Tibet, he always has a "junior" Chinese official "under" him who exercises the real power. In most important offices, such as the so called "TAR" Economic Planning Department and the Personnel Department, Chinese officials and clerical staff far outnumber Tibetans.

As regards the so-called elected deputies of the people, all candidates are pre-determined by the concerned Chinese leaders. After the voting the winners are again chosen by the same authorities who had selected the candidates.

And the population of about a half of Tibet, merged into neighbouring Chinese provinces, have been completely deprived of their political identity and rendered an insignificant minority of electorates in their own land.

#74 posting:

Please refer to article posted in #73 for your "1.2 million Tibetan died" fabricated claim.  

Otherwise, #74 posting cited sources like "Tibetan Government in Exile".  

This is equivalent to citing the current mainstream western media's reports and coverage on Tibet, then have people to comment on them.

Well, a comment here, not a slogan,  for #74 posting, as well as for those who keep spreading lies --

"You can fool some of the people all of the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you can not fool all of the people all of the time."  -- Abraham Lincoln.

[ Last edited by liligupta at 26-4-2008 07:24 ]

Quote:

Original posted by Nick at 23-4-2008 19:41
How can you comment the data below? Please, only arguments, no slogans.
Thanks.

Compare the feudal past and the socialist present

Over 1.2 million Tibetans have died as a direct result of the C ...

Do you have any "Evidences stated that...." dated some what post year 2000?

There were already two CCP regime changed since the most recent dated data log you have posted.  Please remove yourself mentally from the era of Mao and Deng.

[ Last edited by neomugen at 24-4-2008 00:57 ]

You quoted material without evidence against the value of 1.2 million Tibetans died... If this value was "fabicated", it should be less than 1.2 million? For such case I can indicate that lower values were calculated for only the Tibetan Autonomous Region with exception of large Tibetan areas included in neighboring Chinese provinces.

Quote:

Original posted by Nick at 24-4-2008 19:52
You quoted material without evidence against the value of 1.2 million Tibetans died... If this value was "fabicated", it should be less than 1.2 million? For such case I can indicate that lower values ...

Hmmm, yes, you are right in saying I don't have material evidence to support the 1.2 million number, because they do not exist.    You will not have material evidence to support your lies, well, unless you make it up of course.  And we have seen plenty of that haven't we?!

Hello everybody. I have been to China for a few days and I was impressed how neat and clean it is there. I expect the China to be the most powerful country in the world in about 20 years. Besides, I am very glad that I found a forum where Western people can discuss with Chinese people. I think we should discuss more, so that we could understand each others opinion better. And here is what I think about the problem of biased media.

Generally, everybody does sometimes some wrong things and does not want other people to know about them. This also concerns corporations, parties and countries, which I will all refer as "organizations". They very much like not to be criticized even if the critique is right. If an organization possesses a kind of mass media (TV station, radio station, a newspaper or to some extend a web portal) then this mass media would be reluctant to write negative things about the organization. In fact, they would do so, only if they know some other widely read source of information would reveal the inconvenient facts.

That is why if an organization want to be perceived as a decent one regardless of whether it does good or bad things, then it should assure that contrary, critical voices could not be heard. And in case of the organization being a country - this often happens.

Suppose you rule a country and you want to keep your reign even if you harm your citizens. Then you should at first forbid public critique against the government. If the citizens know that they can be jailed for discussing inconvenient topics then they will stay quiet. You should also make sure that no independent mass media or news agencies operate in your country, so that you can keep the monopoly of the information. The internet is a problem, but you may track and jail your citizens for broadcasting opinions you don't want to be said. You should also block the foreign web sides which constantly state negative opinions about your rule. Generally, the mass media of other countries are a problem. Therefore, you should find out any kinds of bias in what they claim and repeat that the foreign media are against your country.

This scheme of actions applies and applied to many countries. For example in Poland before 1989 some people were jailed for stating that we should not follow the path of the Communism and that we should not obey what Soviet Union orders us to do. Fortunately, now it is the past, although the previous Polish ruling party gained vast control of the public TV and radio, which started to present its acts in a biased, positive manner. Fortunately, they did not control other media, but they were (and are) constantly complaining about how biased they are. Generally, I see that everywhere in the world, if a government is criticized by the foreign media then it starts complaining that they are biased and do not like the country. I have never heard any ruling party stating: "foreign media claim so many bad things about us, maybe we really do something wrong".

Generally, I think that every government in the world may feel a temptation to control the information passed to the citizens. That is why constitutions of many countries contain explicit statement that the Freedom of the Speech, which is the right to speak freely without censorship, is preserved. Governments try to limit the negative opinions anyway. . USA wants to be perceived as a protector of the Freedom of the Speech, but they also try to control gathering the information about the situation in Iraq.  

Unfortunately the Freedom of Speech is much less protected in many countries for example in Belarus, Cuba, North Korea, Vietnam and China. And this fact greatly decreases reliability of their media.

For example it is obvious that you believe that Tibet and Taiwan are and should be the part of the Great China. You learn that at school, all media presents only the information to support this thesis. In addition, government tries to block the access to the contrary opinions. You cannot read the articles like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tibet (or at least you could not do so a few weeks ago). Baidu limits the search results in order to hide from Chinese people information about many controversial topics. Tell me, why is the government blocking access to some articles for its citizens if not to hide something? The Polish government before 1989 also tried to jam the western Radio Free Europe in order to prevent Poles from hearing about strikes in Polish factories. I see the Chinese government tries now to do the same. Western newspapers write about the Chinese accusations, they mentioned the address of anti-cnn.com, which let me discuss with you here. I can read any Chinese page and nobody dares to forbid me it. And the Chinese government tries to prevent you from reading some western web pages.

About Tibet: It seems that some Western media manipulated the pictures. The article with picture is more attractive than one without it. In addition, media often presents situation as simpler than it is, in order not to confuse the reader, but to leave him or her with a clear view of the situation. Anyway, manipulation of the picture is the shame for those Western media, which did so. However, I do not think that all Western media manipulated and I do not think that all media in the world did so. That is why the ban for all journalists to travel to Tibet is very suspicious. Polish newspapers wrote about both violent behavior of the protesters and about the violent response of the police. I guess you believe that this riot is all the Tibetan and Dalai Lama fault, but think about it: if everything is going so well in Tibet, why the people are protesting there? The Tibetans know that they would face harsh consequences so they must be really frustrated. If, as Chinese government says, they destroyed Chinese shops, then they must be really angry at Chinese. Why? Something must be wrong about how they are treated, but you will not know that because the government will only describe the positive facts of the Chinese reign. Of course there are some positive sides of building the railway to Tibet, but there are also negative ones, but you will not now them, because your government blocks access to the information about them. Tibetans become a minority in their home land. If the government forced you to accept other people to live in your house and now there are more strangers living in your house that the members of your family, would not it frustrate you?

Besides, this decision about forbidding access of foreign media and tourists to Tibet is also clear for me. They want to hide some, probably terrible, things. Even if CNN manipulates the information - there are other media, I do not believe that all foreign media from all countries do not like China. Also for sure not all tourists hold prejudice (you mentions on anti-cnn.com a Canadian one who told the truth) and the best method to get rid of the prejudices is to let people them see how Tibet looks like. I am not biased against China, because I would judge any other country in the similar manner. For example Russians may claim that people are happy in Chechnya, but since they do not let the journalists go there I will believe those who say that Russians torture civilians there. The same refers to American, as they did not allow journalists to visit Guantanamo I did not believe they treat their prisoners fair. Vietnam blocks many web sides about the Degar people (like http://www.montagnard-foundation.org) from the Central Highlands - that is the proof for me that the accusation of persecuting its inhabitants are true.

You mentioned a few regions in which people want independence, like Hawaii or Kostarica. However, there is a big difference: the people there are allowed to state their demands. They can talk openly about independence, they can show flags of their country/region (and the flag of Tibet is forbidden in China), they can manifest and nobody is allowed to shoot at them even if they become violent (police can only use water in order to disperse the crowds). Many regions like Scotland or Catalonia have their own parliament and high level of independence within the country. I guess this could be a solution for Tibet, as Dalai Lama says independence is not necessary.

This post is already too long so I will not write about Taiwan now. I have just a question to you: suppose its citizen do not want to become part of China. Would you force them to do so?

I hope you understand my point of view and we can discuss about it.